Divine Secrets of the Hoops Sisterhood
Interview by Tess Lotta

Laurie Hodges, a forward for California State University at Northridge’s Lady Matadors, labors to block Petra Jackson, a number two guard for the P and P Lady Express. Clearly one of the more experienced players, Jackson shows no fear as she glides in another two. Teammate Paulette Martin moves down court for defense, wrapping up a manageable 71 to 58 win over the Lady Matadors. Easier pickings for the Lady Express compared to running with their hometown WNBA team, the Seattle Storm. But, for this club team, taking it to the glass is as sweet as it gets.

The P and P Lady Express is a semi-pro exhibition team of post-collegiate players stretching from Western Washington University to Indiana-Purdue. As a female athlete, Jackson faced a grim landscape when considering a basketball career after graduating from Southern Illinois in1986. An alumnus of the Missouri Valley Conference, she was familiar with playing against overseas professional teams hired as opponents for the exhibition portion of the collegiate season. Jackson set to work with the idea of gathering other professional-level players who were searching for opportunities within the U.S., and making use of her college contacts, she began marketing a U.S.-based club team to coaches. With the team now in Seattle, Jackson shares management duties with Martin.

Jackson and Martin share a legacy with generations of female athletes halted by institutional sexism. Yet common to the early Title IX generation, they are humble about their personal achievements while grateful to a law that ensured them equal access to interscholastic and intercollegiate athletics. Women’s sports, in general, are just beginning to experience the positive influence of Title IX. A recent statistic reported an increase in female participation in sports of over 300 percent since 1971; the year Title IX became law. Despite a growing opposition, largely made up of male coaches and athletes whose sports programs have traditionally enjoyed healthier budgets than interest, Title IX is credited for enabling women’s basketball to take root. And Jackson and Martin’s resolve grows that much stronger. Positive about the chances of club teams like theirs growing into a strong career option for women players, they cross their fingers for a successful WNBA.

Clamor: Why didn’t you play overseas in the pro leagues when you graduated?

Petra Jackson (PJ): There was not a lot of opportunity to play overseas then because they wanted only six feet and over Americans. But the European teams were playing exhibition games over here and some were competitive and some were not. So I organized the St. Louis Lady Express and later gave [that version of] the team away to someone who kept it going while I started coaching high school and Junior college.

So you became your own agent, manager, and promoter for the Lady Express?

PJ: Yes, I had to make the team and market it across the U.S. to colleges. And considering we had no sponsorship, we had to stay within a certain radius to be able to travel by van. I networked with coaches that I knew and planted the idea that playing us locally and meeting our expenses was financially better. And another very important element to communicate here is that then, as now, it is always hard for women club teams to get [corporate] sponsorship; they will sponsor men at the drop of a hat.

So how do you make money?

PJ: You really don’t without sponsors to cover costs. The more teams you play, the more money you have to put out for travel and other expenses, like taking time off from your job or career if need be. We do fund raisers to try and get the money together. One of our teammates works for the Sonics/Storm organization and we were able to hold a raffle with tickets and an autographed basketball. We also walked around to a bunch of small businesses to get donations. It is definitely hard. I mean, I wish the Lord would just bless us with a sponsor; it really would not take much.

One of your teammates recently went to the WNBA and then to China to play, and a few have landed try-outs. Does playing with the Lady Express open doors to other opportunities?

PJ: For some of the players, it is definitely an opportunity to be seen and network, and for some of us, it is because we enjoy doing it.

Paulette Martin (PM): It is also that once you have been an athlete through college you are used to being in shape and maintaining a certain level of athleticism. Playing on this level assures competition.

Has running the team become any easier with the visibility of the WNBA?

PJ: Not for club teams because the broader women’s game, in general, is undervalued still. Hopefully they can start paying the women in the WNBA better so I can contact all my friends for sponsorship. The male [professional] players sponsor the men’s club teams, but they can afford it.

A Washington Times article reported the minimum WNBA veteran salary at $40,000. My research has revealed that most veterans make just over that, and the league average is about $55,000. I have also read that many of the players have second jobs or play overseas to make expenses like trainers and family. Are there other more lucrative opportunities for women to play professionally besides the WNBA?

PJ: The teams overseas are continuing to be strong, and there is the [Australian] WNBL. But neither the WNBA, WNBL, nor overseas pays enough, really, although overseas can pay better than the WNBA. And when I went to one of the WNBL pro camps a couple of years ago it was only the top four people that got paid anyway. At that time it was around $3,500 and an apartment for the first player, for the season, and then down to $1,000 for the fourth top player.

Clearly money isn’t the only battle for female players. What discrimination do you feel you have encountered as players and businesswomen in a male dominated sport and industry?

PM: I have chosen to see it less like discrimination and more as trying to make interest. The public needs to have interest. How many households are going to watch the WNBA finals vs. the NBA? In our case, doing a female club team, it is the sponsorship that is hard to get.

Is the lack of sponsorship a reflection of cultural values?

PM: I can agree with that, yes. But I believe, eventually, this will become established – it will become a big thing. It didn’t start out where every household was watching the NBA, but it will definitely take us longer than it has the men. It is happening somewhat. I mean some of the women’s [college] programs are better heard of than the men’s. When you think of the Tennessee Volunteers, for example, you think of women’s basketball. Same with Louisiana Tech. Even the guys we play ball with think of women’s basketball with Louisiana Tech because the team has been good and dominant all these years.

Do you feel Title IX has contributed to changing attitudes and improved conditions for women’s athletics?

PM: Definitely. Title IX opened doors that were not available to women. Title IX is about visibility and popularity; it is an equal distribution thing. Colleges are putting money into the sports that have interest, and women’s basketball is now seeing higher public interest because of the equal opportunities created by Title IX. Don’t get me wrong here but college wrestling, for example, is not as well attended overall compared to women’s basketball. Don’t blame Title IX for the public taking an interest when offered a choice.

PJ: How much revenue does field hockey generate compared to football, or men’s and women’s basketball? Colleges are looking at their [sports program] budgets and seeing what generates money for the university. They are reevaluating with the mindset that considers what wrestling, for example, means to a certain university. If you have the families of the team making up a thin audience for a team of 20 guys, and possibly up to 15 are on scholarship – room, board, tuition, fees, and books -- that’s a lot of money. They would have to restructure eventually looking at the big picture.

Do you feel we are ready to do away with Title IX then?

PM: No, we definitely still need it because with it colleges were, and still are, forced to recognize interest in women’s sports. Only in our lifetime have we started to see the benefits of Title IX. Even the game has evolved as interest was supported. Women’s basketball was played at half-court at one time. It was six on six, three played defense and three played offense all the time.

PJ: It is two-fold. They are deleting some men’s sports programs as well as women’s because of the money factor, so that is something that has to be done, unfortunately. If that was the simple situation then I can understand the questioning of Title IX. For the time being Title IX staying strong is important to women’s sports. We are not ready yet to accept and compensate women athletes on an equal basis, be it high school to pro.

I look at the cultural symbols of value and it is pretty clear that Title IX is important. In Seattle alone, there are two massive, brand new, state-of-the-art men’s sports complexes. What does that say to society about the value of women’s sports?

PM: That is exactly right. We have just achieved the first step. We are just beginning to see women as professional athletes. I mean look at the quality of female athletes today; can you imagine the women of the past if they had the opportunities that are emerging today? We would have firmly established leagues, rather than teetering or bankrupt ones, as well as, hopefully, equal pay scales. There are records that are still standing set by the women of yesterday, and that was achieved without what support we do have today. The caliber of women athletes, with support from things like Title IX, will just continue to improve.

PJ: And I don’t think the men are worth all that money they are paying them. Look at the mess it causes with salary wars and conflicts.

As women athletes are becoming sports stars, the biology issue we can never escape is heating up. The WNBA is playing a PR balancing act between selling sex via women players and imaging them as serious athletes. How do you think the cultural status quo of marketing women as sex objects affects the sport?

PM: It depends what you are in it for. For example, Anna Kournikova, she does not give a damn. People get mad at her because she is making money from the doors playing tennis has opened for her. You can’t be mad at that. Professional sports is a business, female athletes view themselves more and more as businesswomen, so if you look at it that way it is a matter of opinion. Look at Lisa Harrison as a prime example. She was considered the best looking player in the WNBA and she was asked to pose for Playboy, but they wouldn’t pay her what she wanted so she refused. And I don’t blame her. How much do they pay Michael Jordan for keeping his underwear on? Consider how much they would shell out if he were naked.

So what you’re saying is that by using our sexuality the stakes will be higher for women in terms of return on the investment and public opinion?

PJ: For me, if hey asked me to do a Jockey commercial with short briefs and what not, I would stand there [topless] with my nipples covered and my muscles ripping out. Why not flaunt it if you feel good about yourself? But they are certainly going to pay me what the guys make.

You have illustrated the modern feminist argument on this subject; do not dumb down or hide our sexuality vs. what message is our ownership of it sending when we cooperate in sexualizing ourselves.

PM: You know what broke that barrier was Venus and Serena Williams. They did it on their own, which is the important part. They did their thing, the clothes and hair on the court because they wanted to, because they feel good as women athletes, not because an advertiser told them to be like that. They are being themselves. What they are saying about Sue Bird, like the writer in the Seattle Weekly constantly commenting on how beautiful she is like it is more valuable than her game; that is not under her power.

And at the same time, she should not apologize for his choice to be a culture pimp rather than a sports writer. It was easy for him to sell a basketball pin-up story to his editors rather than a basketball player story because culturally we are trained to value how closely she resembles the beauty myth over her talent, and the article reflected that. How would she control that?

PM: I am OK with him mentioning her looks. But he should have done what sports writers do and written about her game in context with her ability, not in context with her beauty. And Venus and Serena get the same thing. Look at the camera angles next time. It is on their butts and chest more than anything.

PJ: They wouldn’t do that, though, without the outfits.

PM: Not as much, maybe, but they did it before that too. It has always been about that anyway, so why not be in control of it yourself, flaunt it your own way before they do. That, for me, is the difference between Venus and Serena and the Sue Bird article.

At least the WNBA, as a visible institution, is having a dialogue about it. I have submitted my opinions to players on their chat boards.

PM: They are. And in a player’s mind the commercials and endorsements are how you know you are going somewhere in your career. It gets back to public interest. Caress and Calgon need to get into the act (laughs).

PJ: Yes, I like that idea; ‘After a hard day’s work Calgon, take me away.’ But it seriously should be like that, just like the Flexall commercials. It ties in with what the guys do for a living.

Do you think a player’s looks influence WNBA picks?

PJ: Every team has their spokes models. You will never see Shannon Johnson, who is the best point guard in the WNBA, no disrespect to Sue Bird, but you will never see Shannon on anything because she is not attractive. Do you ever see Latasha Byears doing guest appearances? No, because she wants to wear braids and they think that is a thug type image. The WNBA has the people they make money off of.

PM: Oh, but they show those thug guys!

Tell me about the girl’s camp you run with the team?

PJ: I have been doing camps for years, as long as I have coached high school and Junior College. We love to do it. The majority of the time we stand back and watch those kids and ask each other the magic question of how good do you think we would be if we had this opportunity, especially starting that young. I did not start playing basketball until ninth grade.

PM: You get such a thrill knowing that you have taught these girls something and that you are supporting them and the future of the women’s game.

I bet they love hanging out with you.

PJ: We make it fun, they don’t just drill, drill, drill. Lady Express team members play in a lot of tournaments and get free stuff, like bags, t-shirts, and sweatshirts. We give all that stuff out at the camp to the girls. I have trophies made for “best defense,” “most improved,” and it cost us, but we are thinking about making it fun for the kids. It is really very rewarding.

When you look back on such a full career in basketball, what aspects do you consider to be personal successes?

PJ: Basketball has been my life. It has given me opportunities that I wouldn’t have had. I went to school on scholarship. I played in a pro league called the WBA and traveled with the Lady Express and have made a family with them. Coaching and getting involved with the up and coming has been very rewarding as well.

PM: Basketball, in general, has brought me a college degree, friends, travel around the globe. I grew up the youngest of six, and my parents did not have a lot of money, so I could not imagine not having sport, considering that it got me where I am today. Not only do you get an education through scholarships; it teaches you as a person. I have learned life skills, how to deal with different walks of people, and how to accept certain things. I think the richness of life is what I got mostly from basketball and where I am at today.

And even with the battles of having to create many of the opportunities from scratch?

PM: Yes, but I had to go for them, carve them out, even in places where there were none available to me. It started when I was little, when I started to play basketball and the boys didn’t want me to play because I was a girl. Pretty soon, I got better than them as a player, and that prepared me for the new sets of obstacles.

PJ: With P and P Lady Express, we are giving women the opportunity to continue playing because there are limited slots, limited numbers and avenues to go. I mean everybody, even if they are good enough, is not going to play in the WNBA. But you do not lose your will to compete. Lady Express allows for playing at a certain level, and you go out and compete every night, just like in college or the pros.

PM: You know, men have so many different options, so many more options. I think we will get there, and P and P Lady Express is one way that we are helping to make that happen.

Get dialed into the P and P Lady Express at www.ppladyexpress.net.